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Leigh
Warming Up

54 Posts

Posted - 12/13/2008 :  5:10:48 PM  Show Profile  Visit Leigh's Homepage Send Leigh a Private Message  Reply with Quote
So... niddy noddy's were running through my mind. I have an 18" niddy noddy I made out of PVC, and it works great but only makes a 2 yard skein. I was wanting a longer skein (for making self striping yarn), but if I made it too much longer the NN would start to get too large to handle.

I was thinking, what about a double niddy noddy? I wasn't sure if it would work, and I didn't want to spend the money on PVC before I knew. I got the inspiration to try it with tinker toys and it works great! In this case it's an 18" niddy noddy that makes a 4 yd skein. Cool! I think I will buy the PVC connectors and make an adjustable one.

Here's some pics:
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb213/snarlla/P1010054.jpg
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb213/snarlla/P1010055.jpg

ETA- And tinker toy warping mill inspired by KS:
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb213/snarlla/P1010057.jpg

Leigh

kbshee
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USA
4152 Posts

Posted - 12/13/2008 :  5:40:17 PM  Show Profile Send kbshee a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Wow, that is really something! Congrats!

Unfortunately, I can barely keep track of the 'right' way to use a regular niddy noddy, and my head would explode if I tried to use this one.

kim in oregon
http://kbshee.blogspot.com
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KS
Seriously Hooked

862 Posts

Posted - 12/13/2008 :  5:51:35 PM  Show Profile Send KS a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Leigh, I'm impressed!

I handpainted self striping yarn a couple of years ago. I'm a weaver, so I've got lots of equipment for handling large quanties & lengths of yarn. I used my warping mill.

Here's a link to some weaving equipment for warping looms:

http://www.woolery.com/Pages/warping.html

I can't wait to see what you come up with that inspiration!

KS
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Leigh
Warming Up

54 Posts

Posted - 12/13/2008 :  6:01:12 PM  Show Profile  Visit Leigh's Homepage Send Leigh a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Kim- I have to look up how to use a niddy noddy every time. I just have to remember up down, up down. This one works just the same, it's even the same arm motion.

KS- Yes! I've been looking at weaving equipment online off and on all day today trying to figure out the easiest way to get a longer skein. I considered trying to make a smallish warping mill out of pvc, but I couldn't figure out exactly how they work. I've never woven before, so I have no idea if the warping mill makes a loop of yarn or what. My next door neighbor has a loom so I might pick her brain. She's kind of stand offish though, so I don't talk to her much. I also considered trying to make a yarn winder with pvc, but it would have to be pretty huge to get a bigger than 4 yd skein.

Leigh
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MindyO
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USA
2493 Posts

Posted - 12/13/2008 :  8:34:38 PM  Show Profile Send MindyO a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Brilliant! That is genius. And so resourceful.

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Chemcats
Permanent Resident

3337 Posts

Posted - 12/14/2008 :  05:37:18 AM  Show Profile Send Chemcats a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Fiber chicks and dudes are so darned clever! Need a tool, and need it NOW...no problem! Just make it yourself with what is on hand.

Well done, Leigh!

Meribeth
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KS
Seriously Hooked

862 Posts

Posted - 12/14/2008 :  06:50:54 AM  Show Profile Send KS a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I found this page that shows how to wind a warp on a warping board:

http://www.allfiberarts.com/library/aa99/aa100999.htm

A warping mill is similar, but instead of going around pegs on the side you go around the vertical supports of the warping mill. You just keep turning the mill the same direction, sprialing the yarn around until you get to the bottom. Then you turn it the other way spiraling back the top.

The cross they talk about is to keep the threads all in the order they were when the warp was wound. You can ignore that & just go around & around. I did put a counting one in when I did it for handpainted yarn. Instead of alternating which way you go around the pegs for the cross, you change in groups. I do it in groups of 10. You can use the thread the way they show too.

There are 2 advantages of warping mills over warping boards. One is they are set up to make longer warps, though you can make shorter ones too. Mine has holes to move the bottom pegs up further. The 2nd is they are easier on the body. If you go with a warping board, try to hang it on the wall. It's really hard on your back if you lay it on the table.

If that's not clear, let me know & I'll try again.

KS
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Leigh
Warming Up

54 Posts

Posted - 12/14/2008 :  07:37:51 AM  Show Profile  Visit Leigh's Homepage Send Leigh a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I see, I think...

The only thing I'm not quite clear on is the "change in groups" part. Are you saying that when you did this for self striping yarn you crossed the yarn every 10 wraps to keep track of how many wraps you had? So when you do that does it make it harder to reskein the yarn after dying? I guess with a long loop length you can't put it on a swift anyway.

Hmm, okay, I see a tinker toy warping mill on the agenda today. I'll have to wait for dd to get up so I can raid her tinker toys again. LOL! BTW, she thought the tinker toy niddy noddy was pretty cool.

Leigh
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Leigh
Warming Up

54 Posts

Posted - 12/14/2008 :  07:40:12 AM  Show Profile  Visit Leigh's Homepage Send Leigh a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Oh, and another question... does the warping mill have pegs where each spiral goes, or just at the top, bottom and crossing points? I don't know if that makes sense. What I mean is does each spiral that goes around rest on a peg or do you just space each wrap by eyeballing the distance between spirals?

Leigh
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Leigh
Warming Up

54 Posts

Posted - 12/14/2008 :  09:25:57 AM  Show Profile  Visit Leigh's Homepage Send Leigh a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ha! Okay, tinker toy warping mill. http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb213/snarlla/P1010057.jpg

Let's see, each side is 8.5" so one full revolution around would make ~34", so that's 34" down, and 34" back up. So that's almost 2 yds per revolution. So 4 times around would make a skein of about 7.5 yards, and 6 times around would make a skein of about 11 yards! I think this is the way to go!

I think I got it right. DD added a cross bar that I didn't notice until after I took the picture, so that's the blue bar running across the middle that doesn't seem to be fully attached. She's dismantled it now, so I can't fix it and take another pic.



Leigh
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dschmidt
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3935 Posts

Posted - 12/14/2008 :  2:38:32 PM  Show Profile Send dschmidt a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Very clever solution -- tinker toys have a whole new meaning to me.

Donna in VA

The Honor Roll? It's easier here than in school. Scroll up to "Want to Make Betty Happy?" and be an Honor Roll member.
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eldergirl
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USA
1784 Posts

Posted - 12/14/2008 :  5:19:07 PM  Show Profile Send eldergirl a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Leigh, you are a clever sticks!

Anna
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lella
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9712 Posts

Posted - 12/15/2008 :  6:26:10 PM  Show Profile Send lella a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Isn't that amazing. Congratulations on your ingenuity! Tinker Toys are now all plastic? hmmm? Didn't know that.

Zippiknits

The happiest people don't necessarily have the best of everything; they just make the best of everything they have.
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Sticks and String
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USA
1113 Posts

Posted - 12/16/2008 :  1:51:36 PM  Show Profile  Visit Sticks and String's Homepage Send Sticks and String a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Oh, this will go nicely with the Tinker Toy swift I have! Thanks so much for sharing! You are very clever!!

(Lella...you can still find the wooden ones at yard sales and thrift stores. :)


Jo
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Leigh
Warming Up

54 Posts

Posted - 12/16/2008 :  2:55:08 PM  Show Profile  Visit Leigh's Homepage Send Leigh a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks very much! I saw those tinker toy swifts online earlier. They are cool! I have to say what I used aren't actually tinker toys, now that I look. They are called "Superstructs". They are like tinker toys, but plastic. I think Tinker toys makes a plastic set too though.

I wound up some yarn on my makeshift yarn mill and just dyed it today. How exciting! The yarn mill is kind of wobbly around it's axis, but entirely usable. Winding the yarn was a very slow process, but I can't figure out how to make it any faster. I imagine winding yarn on a real one is pretty tedious too. I think one made out of pvc would be perfect. Gotta figure out how to do that. I can figure it all out except exactly how to do the middle part, the axis basically. There's going to have to be some drilling and some washers. I'd also like to add a way to adjust the bottom peg. Hmm...

Leigh
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KS
Seriously Hooked

862 Posts

Posted - 12/16/2008 :  6:37:59 PM  Show Profile Send KS a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Sorry I didn't get back to you. Between the forum being slow & my own computer issues, I haven't had time to check in on the fun stuff. It looks like you've figured it out yourself.

The pegs are only on the top & bottom. When I use my warping mill I take a piece of string, yarn, or whatever, tie it onto the starting peg & measure it out to be the length I want the warp to be. I then put a slip knot at that point. I experiment with what path around it makes the warp the length I want. You don't get exact to the inch.

I'm guessing you're constructing it each time you want to use it, so you could add as many pegs as you want to get closer to the length you want.

The process of dyeing the yarn creates a yarn package that's not the same length as you started with. I just looped mine back over the warping mill in a path that let it not fall in a mess. I unwound mine from the warping mill. It was a slow process!

I have seen pictures of PVC pipe yarn blockers that people have made. It's a similar concept. Try searching for PVC yarn blocker.

One thing to keep in mind is that when you wrap yarn around a structure a number of times, a considerable amount of tension can build up. I've seen pegs slanting towards each other from the tension. If you figure you socks might take 300 yds, & your hank is 11 yds per circle, that's about 28 wraps. It's far less than when I wind a warp. That could be 500 or more wraps, though I'd likely do it in 2 sections. That's means you probably wont' have a problem, but it's something to keep in mind.

Winding your simiulated warp gets faster with practice. A purpose built one designed with weavers in mind probably works more smoothly too. Having said that, if it's an occasional project & you're not planning on becoming a weaver, You've got a great tool there.

KS
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Leigh
Warming Up

54 Posts

Posted - 12/17/2008 :  08:49:46 AM  Show Profile  Visit Leigh's Homepage Send Leigh a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thanks KS! The yarn was dry this morning and I put it back on the toy mill and wound it into a ball on my yarn winder. It was surprisingly easy and a lot faster to unwrap than it was to wrap. I think I was lucky and got the yarn back on just right on the first try. I had managed to get a cross in it even though I didn't mean to. I think I know what I did (inadvertently crossed it when I wrapped it OVER the top peg instead of under). Still it was very quick to unwind.

I dyed 100 grams or about 500 yards of fingering weight yarn for some socks. I didn't have any problems with the wrap causing too much tension on the toy mill. Maybe I wrapped it loosely enough, because I can see where that would be a problem.

When I was dealing with the long skein I developed a lot of respect for you weavers. My skein for this project was only about 8 yards, and I can't imagine dealing with a 20 yard or more skein! Yikes!

Anyway, this was fun. I've done up the plans for a PVC yarn mill, and I think it wold cost me about $50 to build. Most of that cost being for the special furniture grade pvc joints that I would need. Right now though, like you suggested, the little tinker toy one seems surprisingly okay to use for an occasional small project!

Leigh
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